Owner Buys Phony Stallion Share
Trot Insider would like to remind owners and participants to perform due diligence when making purchases after a prominent owner says he was recently sold what turned out to be a fraudulent share in pacing stallion Somebeachsomewhere.
Allan Saul told Trot Insider that the horse trader from the Chicago area who sold him the share was familiar to him as someone who had discussed potential broodmare prospects from time to time.
"We were talking... and then he mentioned 'are you interested in any breedings when it comes to Somebeachsomewhere and Captaintreacherous?' I said 'absolutely, if the price is right'. He said he's got two shares somebody's selling."
Saul knew of another possible buyer for the Captaintreacherous share but he was most interested in the share in Somebeachsomewhere. The prices were in Saul's range so he gave the deal the go-ahead.
"I said to him draw up the papers and everything. He sent it over, and he needed a deposit -- which I gave him. And he told me that it might take two or three weeks because you have to put it through the syndicate whenever you sell a share."
It was after a few days when Saul started to do a bit more digging into the nature and origin of the share that the longtime owner started to wonder.
"I started to do a little bit of investigating because I wanted a copy of the share after the deposit, about three of four days later. He says 'I've got that don't worry about that'." said Saul. "I asked him again to send me a copy, and then I got stories after stories...he's in the hospital with sick children, and he hasn't been home for three or four days, as soon as he needs to get some clothes he'll go there and fax it to me.
"So I started making some phone calls. First I called Hanover Shoe Farms and they told me that there's been no letter that's gone out at all in the last month for the selling of shares and then I knew something was off. Then I called the person he said I was buying the share from, Jerry Silva. And Jerry said 'I don't even own a Somebeachsomewhere share'. So then I knew that something was wrong."
Saul told the agent that he wanted his deposit back and is willing to take him to court to do so. Above and beyond that, he wants other owners not to fall victim for the same scam. This is the first time in 45 years he's had a deal like this end up being fraudulent.
"Obviously he's ran into some problems so he's taking money from people on deposits on things he doesn't have, and I wanted horsemen to be aware. I feel terrible about it so if I can help somebody along the way I wanted to put a warning out."
Dean Nixon, I agree with what
Dean Nixon, I agree with what you say. However I'll ask the same question I asked previously. What power does SC or USTA to govern these guys? They don't even have to be licensed to do what they do. In fact I know of a few who have been sanctioned or refused membership by these bodies and have continued in their nefarious ways.
Does SC or USTA have the power to do anything about these guys. Of course publicizing their ill gotten gains will help some people avoid their clutches.
At one time I ran a sales
At one time I ran a sales agency and brokered the sale of several horses. Sometimes people would maneuver around the commission, sometimes an agent working on the other end would be attempting to swindle their client and therefore I would be guilty by assosciation. I decided this was no longer something I would lik to be part of.
I do think the time has come for agents to be licensed at least through the record keeping bodies (USTA &SC). All offers and financial dealings should be handled in a more professional manner, especially with high priced animals the way one would broker the sale of property. The potential to earn a substantial exists as the potential for significant fraud as well as double indemnity exists. There is too much potential for damage to the industry for there not to be regulation of this facet.
Mr McGill, Its almost
Mr McGill, Its almost certainly the same guy. I hope the story about his daughter is not true. However I know of at least two other people with whom he has used the same story.
I had a very similar incident
I had a very similar incident a few months ago by an Illinois broker. ( Sounds like the same guy) I was going to purchase a horse from him. I ask to speak to the owner of the horse and he gave me a phone number to call to talk to him. I called the number and talked to the guy that said he was the owner and he was very convincing and just said he was trying to reduce his stable. So I did try to confirm my purchase by talking to who I thought was a very prominent owner in Florida but who was actually another scammer used by the broker. When I tried to get my money back from the broker he always had an excuse the main one he used was he was in the hospital with his 7 year old daughter who they just diagnosed with cancer. He was always either waiting while she was in surgery or talking to her doctors.
I have been led to believe
I have been led to believe that the person in question is now incarcerated.
Neither USTA , nor SC has the power to put these guys out of business. So, they won't license them. So what? How does that stop them from doing business?
I believe that a horse agent doing business in Kentucky now needs to be licensed by the state..
When the Rowe family opened
When the Rowe family opened Windsor Raceway (with the incompairable Joe Defrank at the helm} a Windsor Raceway pass was needed to gain entrance to the backstretch,along with an O R C licence.
I was told that it was to keep " Agents" and others in the parking lot.
I agree with George. They
I agree with George. They should be licensed by SC/USTA same as real estate etc.
Still no disclosure who this guy is so we can all avoid him. But I imagine this story has put him out of business.
A reputable agent would never
A reputable agent would never ask for a deposit when putting a deal together. They get paid when the deal is closed. That means the purchase money has been received and the ownership has been transferred. If you involve yourself with agents who are not willing to work like this, I suggest you find someone else to deal with because your chances of an issue will greatly increase.
Transparency is a must in any deal. If someone you are dealing with will not let you speak directly to the party you are looking to purchase from, should you ask, then that should be a huge warning sign to you.
I was lucky, purchased a
I was lucky, purchased a young horse out of Maine about 5 years back. Agent wanted a deposit, but I requested that the transfer of ownership be done before I went to the bank to transfer the $$$$$$...things went ok, but a month later this agent had a $10,000 fine with SC...very lucky
One needs to be vigilant in
One needs to be vigilant in this or any other business. It is indeed a terrible story. But one needs to know who one is dealing with. In the words of Ronald Reagan "Trust, but verify".
Let's name this fraud so
Let's name this fraud so nobody else has an issue.
I get approached by "Agents" all the time from the U.S. They never buy anything and I never sign over any rights. Perhaps, "Agents" should be listed with the USTA and SC before they can buy and sell. Perhaps a bond etc.
This is a terrible story in
This is a terrible story in an already troubled industry. What about giving us the name of the agent.